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Author Topic: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!  (Read 1445 times)

Offline BrewBama

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2024, 12:18:25 pm »
I use milkstone remover as well.


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Offline majorvices

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2024, 06:33:15 am »
I would argue that if you are getting infections it isn't because something hasn't been sanitized, rather something isn't getting cleaned. You can't sanitize something that is dirty. And sanitization is just an extra precaution. You could take your chances and rack a wort into a clean fermenter that hasn't been sanitized and most likely it will be fine. You can't say the same thing about a dirty fermenter.

Offline pete b

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2024, 08:15:06 am »
I would argue that if you are getting infections it isn't because something hasn't been sanitized, rather something isn't getting cleaned. You can't sanitize something that is dirty. And sanitization is just an extra precaution. You could take your chances and rack a wort into a clean fermenter that hasn't been sanitized and most likely it will be fine. You can't say the same thing about a dirty fermenter.
I agree 100% with this and would add that a couple places I try to pay special attention to are spigots on fermenters and racking cane and tubing. They both need to be taken apart to clean and racking cane set ups should be replaced fairly regularly.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2024, 08:37:14 am by pete b »
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Offline Kevin

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2024, 08:41:26 am »
I would argue that if you are getting infections it isn't because something hasn't been sanitized, rather something isn't getting cleaned. You can't sanitize something that is dirty. And sanitization is just an extra precaution. You could take your chances and rack a wort into a clean fermenter that hasn't been sanitized and most likely it will be fine. You can't say the same thing about a dirty fermenter.

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Offline goose

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2024, 10:38:38 am »
I would argue that if you are getting infections it isn't because something hasn't been sanitized, rather something isn't getting cleaned. You can't sanitize something that is dirty. And sanitization is just an extra precaution. You could take your chances and rack a wort into a clean fermenter that hasn't been sanitized and most likely it will be fine. You can't say the same thing about a dirty fermenter.

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Agree, agree, agree!

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Offline brewthru

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2024, 04:01:08 pm »
Hi Everyone -

I've brewed for years and always thought of cleanliness as THE most important ingredient.  No matter how studious (eg dismantle valves, thorough use of Star San) once in a while I get a contaminated beer from some microorganism.

I JUST learned that the Star San site says to use their product within an hour!  They say, "Star San is an EPA registered sanitizer and must be used immediately. We do not recommend using it if has been in solution longer than an hour."

THERE's my culprit!  I've saved Star San in mixture from one brew to the next, usually changing out wfter two brew projects.  I further read on their site that Star San converts to sugar (thus the reason it is not harmful to us humans). 

I've been sanitizing with sugar water!

I just wanted to share to save others from the same problem!

I haven't read thru all of the replies. However, in my own experience, I'd recommend checking all values and any adapters. Years ago, I bought a Blickmann fermenter from another homebrewer for a, IMO, crazy low price. I asked them, "OK, what's the catch?". They honestly replied, "All of my batches are infected.". While we quaffed a few at a brewpub I quizzed the seller as to what was causing the infection. I had some clues. Paid him for the Blickmann fermenter and ran away like he*l before he changed his mind.

Arriving home with the Blickmann fermenter I do a complete tear down. Remove all of the ball valves and barbs. My plan is to take apart all of the ball values, inspect, definitely clean or replace as needed. However, it was immediately apparent the cause of the infections. A nylon barb on one of the valves. The nylon barb was filled with mold! Wasn't easy to see while still attached with to the ball valve. I quickly threw the nylon barb and ball valve into the trash outside. I installed a new ball valve and a new stainless barb and have had zero problems since. I've now had the fermenter for 8 years without problems. Recently brewed a cream ale in the fermenter. Of course I had to sample before cold crashing. Yum.

Offline fredthecat

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2024, 07:05:32 pm »
Hi Everyone -

I've brewed for years and always thought of cleanliness as THE most important ingredient.  No matter how studious (eg dismantle valves, thorough use of Star San) once in a while I get a contaminated beer from some microorganism.

I JUST learned that the Star San site says to use their product within an hour!  They say, "Star San is an EPA registered sanitizer and must be used immediately. We do not recommend using it if has been in solution longer than an hour."

THERE's my culprit!  I've saved Star San in mixture from one brew to the next, usually changing out wfter two brew projects.  I further read on their site that Star San converts to sugar (thus the reason it is not harmful to us humans). 

I've been sanitizing with sugar water!

I just wanted to share to save others from the same problem!

I haven't read thru all of the replies. However, in my own experience, I'd recommend checking all values and any adapters. Years ago, I bought a Blickmann fermenter from another homebrewer for a, IMO, crazy low price. I asked them, "OK, what's the catch?". They honestly replied, "All of my batches are infected.". While we quaffed a few at a brewpub I quizzed the seller as to what was causing the infection. I had some clues. Paid him for the Blickmann fermenter and ran away like he*l before he changed his mind.

Arriving home with the Blickmann fermenter I do a complete tear down. Remove all of the ball valves and barbs. My plan is to take apart all of the ball values, inspect, definitely clean or replace as needed. However, it was immediately apparent the cause of the infections. A nylon barb on one of the valves. The nylon barb was filled with mold! Wasn't easy to see while still attached with to the ball valve. I quickly threw the nylon barb and ball valve into the trash outside. I installed a new ball valve and a new stainless barb and have had zero problems since. I've now had the fermenter for 8 years without problems. Recently brewed a cream ale in the fermenter. Of course I had to sample before cold crashing. Yum.

thats a great story, and with a lot of things - it is simply a matter of carefully stripping it down as much as possible and finding the problem part, replacing, cleaning or fixing it and putting it back together.

im actually going to attempt to do that to a tv having issues soon, just following a google guide to replace i think a capacitor in it.

there is no need for throwaway culture.

Offline BrewBama

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2024, 07:40:45 am »
….
there is no need for throwaway culture.

+1. I get self satisfaction when I fix stuff myself.

Offline John M

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2024, 08:01:03 am »
The only time I ever had "off" beers was the year after I started brewing, and wasn't cleaning my plate chiller properly. Took a few batches to learn this the hard way. I eventually discovered that my plate chiller stunk! I still use a plate chiller, and haven't had any issues since.
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Offline Richard

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2024, 09:14:02 am »
….
there is no need for throwaway culture.

+1. I get self satisfaction when I fix stuff myself.

Me, too, but tiny surface-mount components make it nearly impossible for an individual to diagnose and replace parts at home.
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Offline Drewch

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2024, 12:01:26 pm »
….
there is no need for throwaway culture.

+1. I get self satisfaction when I fix stuff myself.

Me, too, but tiny surface-mount components make it nearly impossible for an individual to diagnose and replace parts at home.

That and custom molded plastic components that aren't available aftermarket (or cost as much as the unit)....
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Offline CounterPressure

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #26 on: June 03, 2024, 09:26:23 am »
I haven't read thru all of the replies. However, in my own experience, I'd recommend checking all values and any adapters. Years ago, I bought a Blickmann fermenter from another homebrewer for a, IMO, crazy low price. I asked them, "OK, what's the catch?". They honestly replied, "All of my batches are infected.". While we quaffed a few at a brewpub I quizzed the seller as to what was causing the infection. I had some clues. Paid him for the Blickmann fermenter and ran away like he*l before he changed his mind.

Arriving home with the Blickmann fermenter I do a complete tear down. Remove all of the ball valves and barbs. My plan is to take apart all of the ball values, inspect, definitely clean or replace as needed. However, it was immediately apparent the cause of the infections. A nylon barb on one of the valves. The nylon barb was filled with mold! Wasn't easy to see while still attached with to the ball valve. I quickly threw the nylon barb and ball valve into the trash outside. I installed a new ball valve and a new stainless barb and have had zero problems since. I've now had the fermenter for 8 years without problems. Recently brewed a cream ale in the fermenter. Of course I had to sample before cold crashing. Yum.
I hate to resurrect and old thread but...

I have a similar story.  Bought a Used MoreBeer conical which upon inspection, had massive beerstone inside the tube leading to the drain valve TC connection.  Cleaned well with PBW and some elbow grease, and I've made beer in that for at least 10 years or more without a single issue.

That said, EVERY brew, I clean EVERY vessel with PBW.  Every keg is cleaned with PBW, poppets removed and put on the stove in PBW (up to about ~140F). Every valve is disassembled and cleaned that way also.  I use buckets in the brewing process, they also get it, even though they're only used for the Mash and wort.  It just doesn't take that much time.  I have not had a contaminated batch of beer since I began using PBW and Star San eons ago.  I do agree with a few above, I prefer Saniclean for some things, but I still use both.  Mine also is stored in a 5 gallon bucket with lid on, and I use it for several brews in a row before changing it out.  In my case it was due to ignorance since I'd never heard of this 1 hour thing... I guess I must really clean well!  :D

For Passivation, I require heat unfortunately.  I use Citrisurf 77 SS Pasivation Solution.  I find it far less effective if I can't get the item to boil, or at least steam the acid.  But nonetheless, I still use it on items I can't get that hot because I feel some activity is better than nothing.

https://www.amazon.com/CitriSurf-Stainless-Remover-Passivation-Cleaner/dp/B076CTWRVS?th=1
Welding shops often carry this stuff for passivating the HAZ area of a SS welds.

PSA, If you use PBW, it recommends using water hotter than the wash water for rinsing.  I don't know how often folks read the instructions and follow, but I think this is important.

Another note, I always make sure Kegs, fermenters and containers are totally dry before storing away. Otherwise you run the risk of getting mold or bacteria started.  If you open a container and it smells like ANYTHING, re-clean it and re-sanitize it.

Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #27 on: June 03, 2024, 11:38:59 am »
im actually going to attempt to do that to a tv having issues soon, just following a google guide to replace i think a capacitor in it.

Are your TV shows getting infected?
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Offline Lazy Ant Brewing

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #28 on: June 03, 2024, 11:50:43 am »
Hi Everyone -

Ive brewed for years and always thought of cleniliness as THE most important ingredient.  No matter how studious (eg dismantle valves, thorough use of Star San) once in a while I get a contaminated beer from some microorganism.

I JUST learned that the Star San site says to use their product within an hour!  They say, "Star San is an EPAs registered sanitizer and must be used immediately. We do not recommend using it if has been in solution longer than an hour."

THERE's my culprit!  Ive saved Star San in mixture from one brew to the next, usually changing out wfter two brew projects.  I further read on their site that Star San converts to sugar (thus the reason it is not harmful to us humans). 

Ive been sanitizing with sugar water!

I just wanted to share to save others from the same problem!
You don’t seem to mention if you are using a cleaner and then sanitizing. Star San is NOT a cleaner.   Your regimen should include both items.

+1

On a homebrew level, I believe that proper cleaning is far more important than sanitizing.

+2  When I first started homebrewing I did a few batches with PBW cleaning only not realizing I was supposed to sanitize too and the brews turned out fine.  No spoiled batches.
It's easier to get information from the forum than to sacrifice virgins to appease the brewing gods when bad beer happens!

Offline fredthecat

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Re: Been on the hunt for WHY I occasionally get a contaminated brew!
« Reply #29 on: June 03, 2024, 04:00:26 pm »
im actually going to attempt to do that to a tv having issues soon, just following a google guide to replace i think a capacitor in it.

Are your TV shows getting infected?

lol i think it was referring to googling to fix a problem