[erockrph]

I listened to this episode today and I enjoyed it a lot. Thanks to Dave for asking the questions and to Denny and Drew for answering them!. I thought it was interesting that Dave used S-04 for a lager that turned out good. Great Fementations homebrew supply also recommends S-04 as a dry yeast option with for their Oktoberfest kit along with 34/70.

Glad you liked it.  I'ma gonna use S-04 a whole heck of a lot more in the future.  I said it someplace, might have been in the episode but I think on some other forum -- I think from now on I might use S-04 wherever I used to use US-05, because it ferments and flocs out faster, and hey it might even be cleaner!?!?

Have you tried BRY-97?  If not, you should.

Only twice, years ago... and I wasn't pleased with the result either time.  However I'd be willing to give it another shot.  Maybe the errors were mine and not the yeast's fault, as I know BRY-97 gets great reviews from most who've tried it.  Thanks for the suggestion.

If you're looking for a clean yeast, it's worlds cleaner than 04 or 05.  Very attenuative and clears better than 05.

I agree that it clears better than 05, but I don't know whether I'd call it worlds cleaner. I still prefer US05 for hoppier styles. I find that late/dry hop character is enhanced a bit better by 05 than BRY-97. I like them both, but each has their own uses for me.

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[denny]

I listened to this episode today and I enjoyed it a lot. Thanks to Dave for asking the questions and to Denny and Drew for answering them!. I thought it was interesting that Dave used S-04 for a lager that turned out good. Great Fementations homebrew supply also recommends S-04 as a dry yeast option with for their Oktoberfest kit along with 34/70.

Glad you liked it.  I'ma gonna use S-04 a whole heck of a lot more in the future.  I said it someplace, might have been in the episode but I think on some other forum -- I think from now on I might use S-04 wherever I used to use US-05, because it ferments and flocs out faster, and hey it might even be cleaner!?!?

Have you tried BRY-97?  If not, you should.

Only twice, years ago... and I wasn't pleased with the result either time.  However I'd be willing to give it another shot.  Maybe the errors were mine and not the yeast's fault, as I know BRY-97 gets great reviews from most who've tried it.  Thanks for the suggestion.

If you're looking for a clean yeast, it's worlds cleaner than 04 or 05.  Very attenuative and clears better than 05.

I agree that it clears better than 05, but I don't know whether I'd call it worlds cleaner. I still prefer US05 for hoppier styles. I find that late/dry hop character is enhanced a bit better by 05 than BRY-97. I like them both, but each has their own uses for me.

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Maybe it's the fruitiness from 05 enhancing the hops? 

[erockrph]

I listened to this episode today and I enjoyed it a lot. Thanks to Dave for asking the questions and to Denny and Drew for answering them!. I thought it was interesting that Dave used S-04 for a lager that turned out good. Great Fementations homebrew supply also recommends S-04 as a dry yeast option with for their Oktoberfest kit along with 34/70.

Glad you liked it.  I'ma gonna use S-04 a whole heck of a lot more in the future.  I said it someplace, might have been in the episode but I think on some other forum -- I think from now on I might use S-04 wherever I used to use US-05, because it ferments and flocs out faster, and hey it might even be cleaner!?!?

Have you tried BRY-97?  If not, you should.

Only twice, years ago... and I wasn't pleased with the result either time.  However I'd be willing to give it another shot.  Maybe the errors were mine and not the yeast's fault, as I know BRY-97 gets great reviews from most who've tried it.  Thanks for the suggestion.

If you're looking for a clean yeast, it's worlds cleaner than 04 or 05.  Very attenuative and clears better than 05.

I agree that it clears better than 05, but I don't know whether I'd call it worlds cleaner. I still prefer US05 for hoppier styles. I find that late/dry hop character is enhanced a bit better by 05 than BRY-97. I like them both, but each has their own uses for me.

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Maybe it's the fruitiness from 05 enhancing the hops?

Possibly, although I don't really consider it fruity. It is by comparison to other neutral ale yeasts, but when I think US-05 "fruity" isn't the first descriptor that comes to mind.

I find that some flocculant strains have less hop expression. I've read (from Stan H, I think) that hop oils can adsorb to the surface of yeast and end up getting pulled out when the yeast flocs out. I haven't found that this is universal, but I have noticed that my experience with several strains tends to trend like this (i.e., more flocculant strains have a higher tendency to reduce hop flavor compared to less flocculant ones). I think this is why certain yeast strains work better for NEIPAs, and this is my guess why I prefer US05 over BRY97 in late hopped beers.

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[hopfenundmalz]

I listened to this episode today and I enjoyed it a lot. Thanks to Dave for asking the questions and to Denny and Drew for answering them!. I thought it was interesting that Dave used S-04 for a lager that turned out good. Great Fementations homebrew supply also recommends S-04 as a dry yeast option with for their Oktoberfest kit along with 34/70.

Glad you liked it.  I'ma gonna use S-04 a whole heck of a lot more in the future.  I said it someplace, might have been in the episode but I think on some other forum -- I think from now on I might use S-04 wherever I used to use US-05, because it ferments and flocs out faster, and hey it might even be cleaner!?!?

Have you tried BRY-97?  If not, you should.

Only twice, years ago... and I wasn't pleased with the result either time.  However I'd be willing to give it another shot.  Maybe the errors were mine and not the yeast's fault, as I know BRY-97 gets great reviews from most who've tried it.  Thanks for the suggestion.

If you're looking for a clean yeast, it's worlds cleaner than 04 or 05.  Very attenuative and clears better than 05.

I split a batch between US-05 and BRY-97, and the BRY-97 was preferred.

[Kevin]

Bonus points if anyone is old enough to know where the "Dave's not here" reference comes from. Double bonus points if you have the album on vinyl.

[Joe Sr.]

Oy! Definitely old enough but don’t have the album. Was it on the same album as basketball Jones?

Santa Claus and his old lady is a Christmas standard in our home.

Never used BRY-97. I want to say I’ve gotten peach flavor from us-05 but I’ve been happy with it lately.

I’ll try to check out the podcast.


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[denny]

Oy! Definitely old enough but don’t have the album. Was it on the same album as basketball Jones?

Santa Claus and his old lady is a Christmas standard in our home.

Never used BRY-97. I want to say I’ve gotten peach flavor from us-05 but I’ve been happy with it lately.

I’ll try to check out the podcast.


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Basketball Jones was Bill Cosby

[erockrph]

Oy! Definitely old enough but don’t have the album. Was it on the same album as basketball Jones?

Santa Claus and his old lady is a Christmas standard in our home.

Never used BRY-97. I want to say I’ve gotten peach flavor from us-05 but I’ve been happy with it lately.

I’ll try to check out the podcast.


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Basketball Jones was Bill Cosby

I think you may have listened to too much C&C back in the day

Basketball Jones featuring Tyrone Shoelaces was definitely Cheech and Chong

https://youtu.be/DlhWPVJNAOo

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[denny]

Oy! Definitely old enough but don’t have the album. Was it on the same album as basketball Jones?

Santa Claus and his old lady is a Christmas standard in our home.

Never used BRY-97. I want to say I’ve gotten peach flavor from us-05 but I’ve been happy with it lately.

I’ll try to check out the podcast.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Basketball Jones was Bill Cosby

I think you may have listened to too much C&C back in the day

Basketball Jones featuring Tyrone Shoelaces was definitely Cheech and Chong

https://youtu.be/DlhWPVJNAOo

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Wow...50 years I've lived under a misconception!

[hopfenundmalz]

Since I was mentioned, I have to Chime in on LODO.

LODO thoughts.
This works if you're making a Helles, German Pilsner, Kölsch, or other beer with a large % of Pilsner malt. Oxidation of the Lipoxygenase (LOX) enzymes will give the Herbstoff (bitter stuff) that I can get in many US attempts at these beers. My wife often doesn't taste it, so I'm sensitive to it, she isn't, for once. This oxidation takes place on the hot side, HSA is real in the right situation (more on this later).

The larger German Breweries with modern brewhouse are LODO. I'm referring to regional and larger breweries. Schönram is a regional that is LODO. Small family breweries are often not. I've picked up Herbstoff in those.

I've been brewing my lagers with LODO for sometime. I think the beers are better. British ales? I don't bother as the beers lack something. One key fact is that malts that are kilned at over 184F have denatured the LOX. That was stated by Joe Henrich (SP) on a MBAA podcast, he has work as malt expert his whole career. Pale ale malts are kilned to a darker Lovibond, which requires a higher kiln temperature so no LOX! If you are making good beers with Maris Otter, that is why. If you read where someone does a LODO experiment with Maris Otter and finds no difference, of course there is no difference!

Cold side techniques have to be good to keep O2 out for German Pilsner based beers. You can lose it on the cold side for those Pilsner based beers. British cask beers oxidize in the cask when vented, and can be seat after a day or two. Oh, many British breweries are not as advanced as the German breweries.

We have a super drinkable German Pilsner on right now. It had LODO on the hot side, and it was fermented in kegs, and spunded to develope the carbonation. We shared some with very knowledgeable friends (one BJCP National, and another an advanced Cicerone) who all loved it.

I brew LODO where it benefits the beer. Some beers don't benefit. Some beers I would take care on the cold side to prolong shelf life.

One final thought, LODO Rauchbier has a longer shelf life. That bacon or ham flavor is due to the smoke phenolics oxidizing.  In Bamberg the Rauchbier tastes like fresh Texas brisket, clean smoke, no aged meat flavors.

[hopfenundmalz]

I brew LODO where it benefits the beer.

So different brewing techniques for different styles of beer.  It's something I've suspected for a while.  Looking forward to reading more about this idea (here? Zymurgy? Book? ...)

Ingradients and process are whar makes a beer. German ingredients and process, yes.

I'm  not sure who would write that. I'm retired.

I've  been kicking around how to write an article about homebrewing a very close approximation  of Schlenkerla Märzen.

[dmtaylor]

"Herbstoff".  Never heard of it.  No idea what it tastes like.  Is it the "hay" thing?  Otherwise it just sounds like yet another justification for why special joes should try LODO.

What can I say.  I guess I ain't special.   

[hmbrw4life]

I brew LODO where it benefits the beer.

So different brewing techniques for different styles of beer.  It's something I've suspected for a while.  Looking forward to reading more about this idea (here? Zymurgy? Book? ...)

https://www.themodernbrewhouse.com/

Has been around since like 2016?

[hmbrw4life]

"Herbstoff".  Never heard of it.  No idea what it tastes like.  Is it the "hay" thing?  Otherwise it just sounds like yet another justification for why special joes should try LODO.

What can I say.  I guess I ain't special.   

Fix wrote about this in like 93' or there abouts

https://www.brewerspublications.com/blogs/author/george-fix

And zee German's have been brewing like this (HSA mitigation) since the late 70's early 80's. This is only new for homebrewers.

[dmtaylor]

Pandora can keep her box intact AFAIAC.