[redrocker652002]

Something I thought about after reading a post from other thread in another board that got me thinking. My OG on this brew was about six point off, est 1.056 actual 1.062. As I was having my coffee and reading new posts, I saw another user with OG issues and some heating issues at the start of the mash. So, I thought back to yesterday and realized, my initial mash temp swung up to about 156 to 158 for about the first 7 to 8 minutes of the mash. I got it cooled down and ran it right at about 152 to 154 the rest of the way with an occasional spike back up to 156. Would the higher heat at the start of the mash cause a higher OG number at the end? I am thinking it might as more sugar was extracted earlier on and maybe some unfermentable stuff as well. I was able to get it down and really it is not a huge deal, but for me, my quest to find out how things work made me think about it. Any input is welcome and appreciated.

In an effort of full disclosure, I posted this on the Homebrew Talk forum as well.  If that is not permitted please feel free to delete. 

[denny]

It might.

[dmtaylor]

Beta enzymes might have mostly or all been denatured when struck with even a short time at an elevated temperature.  This would tend to result in less ATTENUATION, but NOT lower mash efficiency since the alpha will still take care of that part of it.

I would focus more on VOLUME measurements.  If for example you intended to end up with 5.0 gallons but actually ended up with 5.5 gallons, or whatever, your efficiency could be off by like 10%.  Even just if off by a little bit like 5.2 gallons, that's still an apparent loss of 4% brewhouse efficiency right there.

[denny]

Beta enzymes might have mostly or all been denatured when struck with even a short time at an elevated temperature.  This would tend to result in less ATTENUATION, but NOT lower mash efficiency since the alpha will still take care of that part of it.

I would focus more on VOLUME measurements.  If for example you intended to end up with 5.0 gallons but actually ended up with 5.5 gallons, or whatever, your efficiency could be off by like 10%.  Even just if off by a little bit like 5.2 gallons, that's still an apparent loss of 4% brewhouse efficiency right there.

He was over the OG, not under. He's not talking about attenuation.

[dmtaylor]

Beta enzymes might have mostly or all been denatured when struck with even a short time at an elevated temperature.  This would tend to result in less ATTENUATION, but NOT lower mash efficiency since the alpha will still take care of that part of it.

I would focus more on VOLUME measurements.  If for example you intended to end up with 5.0 gallons but actually ended up with 5.5 gallons, or whatever, your efficiency could be off by like 10%.  Even just if off by a little bit like 5.2 gallons, that's still an apparent loss of 4% brewhouse efficiency right there.

He was over the OG, not under. He's not talking about attenuation.

Oops, my bad.  However, the VOLUME feedback still applies, just in the opposite direction.

And interestingly, even if it's not a volume thing.... higher temperatures could explain the higher OG as well, since alpha amylase works just fine, but closer to warp speed at high temp vs. lower temp.

[CounterPressure]

When I first read the question I thought maybe you had a Freudian slip and asked the wrong thing. If what you are asking is will my FG be different, the answer is a resounding yes. If you are really asking if my OG will be different the answer is almost certainly no, but I wouldn't be real strong with that because there will be a little bit of variation. But absolutely, the final gravity will be higher because the amount of fermentable sugar is less in spite of whatever conversion took place. And I'm talking about the higher temperature mash.

[Kevin]

If you are having consistent gravity issues missing high or low all the time then it is possibly an issue with your equipment profile.

[redrocker652002]

Thanks to all who replied.  I have been usually within 2 or 3 points of the recipe OG, but have also been within a degree or two of the mash temps thru to mash.  So, this brew the mash temp took off on me right at the start, which I was able to get back within a few minutes, but stayed higher for the first 10 or so minutes of the mash.  I have read in other posts that the start of the mash is where most of the conversion takes place, so I thought that might have something to do with it.   My brew days are usually very very similar so not sure if that will have anything to do with it, but being a home brewer and not a pro using a propane burner and a bag I am sure there are some little differences either way.  The one thing I noticed as I go back over the day in my head, was the boil size was supposed to be about 6.8 gallons and I want to say it was somewhere in the 6.25 gallon range.  But, my preboil gravity was spot on.  What I should have done was add the water prior to the boil and taken my chances, but I did not and added it post boil.  All good, it is still beer and hopefully will be good.  The positive I am taking from this is my first attempt at reusing yeast, that seemed to have gone well as it seems to be very active.  I will check the gravity next week and see where I am and go from there.  My plan is, in the fermenter until next sunday or monday.  Dry hop for 3 to 4 days and then in the keg with CO2 and cool it down to serving temp.  That usually takes about 3 to 4 days if not more.  Pull a pint about a week later and see where I am.  Again, thanks to all who replied.  The info I get here is really what keeps me going and helps me improve.